Tim: Yes, fortunately John and Perry knew how to shoot. So they went back up, gave Tim a shot gun and they were walking towards the bear and they were going to euthanize the bear of course. But the bear saw them coming and it snapped the cable and it ran directly towards Tim. Perry and John Nylund were a little ways back. And Tim didn’t know how to shoot a shotgun. So he turned around and ran. The bear chased him, he stumbled and the bear bounced over top of him, and reached up with one of its four paws and literally tore the shirt on Tim’s back.
Fortunately, John and Perry were there and they shot the bear before it could turn around and get Tim. That was kind of a classic example of how things could go from bad to terrible potentially without a really good organized approach to wildlife management. It was kind of a free for all, in those early years. So that was a very memorable one and very scary story. A near miss for Tim, but fortunately Johnny and Perry were there and they shot the bear. Sadly, the bear had to die, but Monte shouldn’t have been trapping or snaring bears on his own. In those days, you trap a grizzly you had to move it, there wasn’t the emphasis on protection and resource management and species management that there is now. Someone else would have more details on that story from the Warden Office.
(Tim’s account can be found on YouTube Tim Auger And The Grizzly Bear https://youtu.be/RYM9lWbFWMw)
SH: Tim and his nine lives eh.
Tim: For sure that was one of them.
SH: There’s a book Sid Marty wrote called the Black Grizzly of Whiskey Creek that is about some of that. That’s a good story though.
SH: Do you want to talk about any avalanche stories or enforcement stories, because you guys were doing it all?
Tim: No nothing comes to mind about that but the one about the bear incident was just utterly amazing. How Tim was able to …. he did the right thing when he turned around and ran rather than try to shoot. The other thing that happened was Monte was behind a tree or something and shot the bear with a dart in the ass, thinking that might do something, but of course not, as it ran by him. Seems kind of humourous now how Tim told the story, it was even funny when Tim told it. It was funny, just incredible, that something worse didn’t happen as a result of that.
SH: Wow. Next question really impacted you I think a lot, because you were such a generalist warden. How did the Warden Service change over the years? Centralization, affirmative action, changes in the 1990s, 2000s?
Tim: Those generalist years … because we got moved around in those different duties … it was quite enjoyable because there was quite a bit of variety and there were training opportunities that were actually very good. So when that changed and it became more focused, that also had its positive aspects too, because then they were beginning to hire biologists within the Warden Service, which we didn’t have before. There was only one biologist in each regional office so that lead to a more professional approach across the system in terms of resource management so that was actually pretty good. Also when they went to a university degree, that was good because that meant a lot more women applied for jobs in the Warden Service. Before that there wasn’t very many when it was the technical diploma. But it was also part of the affirmative action, with government hiring in general, but that made for a very positive change to have women in the work place, so that was good.
Tim LaBoucane, Otter Tail valley 1975. Photo courtesy Don Mickle.
But then along came the years of right sizing, re-engineering etc., when they wanted to take the teamwork and good will of the Warden culture that we have talked about, and change that into more of a Parks Canada culture. I’m sure you know how negative that was through the years in the Banff Warden Office. There was so much uncertainty, what was going to happen, there was a lot of secrecy. We knew there was a plan but they’d never tell us what they were going to do. They’d make it look good on the front end, and there were more job cuts. That was very hard on a lot of people, unfortunately, and that continued right up until the time that I retired.
SH: Yes. Tim what year did you retire?
Tim: 2012. I was one of the lucky ones that was told “Hey, we’re cutting your job.” It was right at the time I was going to retire so it worked out pretty good for me. But there were quite a few people in Rev/Glacier that had been working as seasonals, nine month seasonals, and they were all cut down to six months or they were let go. That was hard on people.
SH: The affirmative action …. that’s good I liked your comments there. Tim you were a super success story of the Native Training Program. You and Byron … Did that impact you much or not at all?
Tim: I think it did. There was the initial hiring which was good. It created an opportunity for the groups that hadn’t been hired by the Public Service to then become part of that. So that was positive. And once we were in, we had equal access to training opportunities and developmental opportunities that everybody else did, so there was also positive. But that’s the way it should have been years before we got there.
SH: For sure. It’s nice to see, what they are doing up North with the Inuit hiring. It’s really good.
Tim: Oh for sure.
SH: Do you want to talk about any other changes like the centralization or ….
Tim: No that’s about it. You also know what happened because you were working in that era and saw the changes. Probably from a good perspective because you weren’t right within it but could see it working in the office. I think at that point you were the Admin Support for the Chief of Resource Conservation. Or by then were you working for Professional Dispatch?
SH: No by then I was kind of working for Clair (Israelson) or a Chief Warden depending on the year. That was interesting. (Tape 21:55)
Tim: You put that very well… ‘that was interesting’. There was a lot of negativity, a lot of second guessing and a lot of secrecy. That’s what I remember. Then they’d come up with a new plan and you’d know what was going to happen. You’d be doing, this, this and this and then the following year it would be, you’re not doing that anymore and what are you going to drop.
I did have one comment, in the early years, do you remember a fellow named John Wackerle? So John was very practical. He’d be sitting in the coffee room in Banff and there would be another change coming along. He would have a cigarette, a roll your own, and he would say “Ya, well it’s all the same to me”. So that, what John used to joke about in those years, certainly came true. If you just waited for the next change, then see what’s happening and don’t get too excited about it, just go with the flow. It won’t be that positive, and it won’t make any sense, but it’s coming down from far away and they’re adjusting how they view it should be done, from somewhere far away. So you just have John’s attitude and go with the flow.
SH: Tim do you want to talk at all about Keith Everts?
Tim: Oh ya, Keith Everts …. when I first got there, he was a very positive guy to work with. He liked to…he was a real developer. He came up with the avalanche electronic control system for the highway for the Sunshine access road. He was very collaborative with his approach to work, which was good. I learned a lot about snow and avalanche control working with Tim and Keith at Sunshine for those seven winters, though sometimes the winters got pretty long. So yes, he was good to work with. I was only there for a few years when he became …. I think he was the backcountry guy first, but then he became the Assistant Chief Park Warden or whatever the terminology was back in those days.
SH: The Area Manager for Banff.
Tim: Yes, and was still very supportive, and very bright, he liked to see programs proceed. He did a lot with the backcountry program, I remember that because I was in one of those backcountry working groups for awhile. Overall he was a positive influence, a good guy to work with without getting into any of the specifics. He was able to see how the system worked, get projects funded, make improvements, support staff. Overall very positive to work with.
SH: Yes, he brought me down from Jasper and so he was very important in my career. He was a leader with a lot of things like the computers we got. I remember trying to train all you guys Tim, to know how to type.
Tim: That was terrible when I first started that. Where’s the “W key. I was so used to doing everything in long hand, you know those copies – you’d have three copies: one to your supervisor, you’d put one on file and all that kind of nonsense. It was the dark ages, so you really helped us along.
SH: Yes, Keith was a mover and a shaker with technology and things, and with Dispatch as well.
Tim: That was a really positive change.
SH: Yes, thanks for that. I wanted to make sure something was down about Keith because he’s not here to interview.
Tim: The other thing he did …. They had security guards in the campgrounds at night to try to quell the partying. It was a really big problem in those years. They’d hire term wardens but they wouldn’t give them any support. They’d put them in a campground and if you survived all those night shifts in one summer then the next summer you got to be in the frontcountry, and the following summer you got to be in the backcountry or vice versa. So that was a disaster, that whole program, it wasn’t much of a program.
So Keith set it up, specifically set it up, took people off the seasonal list, hired them as terms but gave them a lot of training. He met with them once a week in the evening at the beginning of their shift, to ask them how things were going. This was a huge change, and he listened to them about what was going on and what improvements could be made to make their job easier to control the partying in the campgrounds. He was able to work quite collaboratively with new green staff, give them guidance, tell them how to deal with situations and give them support which made a huge change. They went to being called campground cowboys, but it was so much better than having the one duty warden, who would have to go up there and try to quell all the parties. So I think they had about six people that became dedicated to that for three or four months during the summer. So that was a huge change, and that was one of the good things he did, especially with entry level staff, getting them off on the right foot for a job that nobody wanted to do. That was a good thing he did.
SH: That was interesting times for sure.
Tim: I’m sure he did a lot more than that, but it’s been a number of years now so I can’t recall details without a lot of pondering. (Tape 27:57).
SH: Yes for sure. He was supportive on the fire program too so that was all good.
Tim: Oh ya, he certainly was.
SH: What about the Warden Service was important to you? Idea of protecting and preserving national parks, keeping people safe, etc.?
Tim: Overall, I would say that the mandate was good. So, you were there for preservation and you were there for resource protection and you were there for assisting the public in terms of visitor safety, that was also good. Just those three big ones, and you have said them (in the question). (Tape 28:11).
SH: Are there any legends or stories associated with the Warden Service that you can share? Is there anyone from the Service that stands out in your mind?
Tim: There’s one really funny one of Tim Auger. There was another old hard-nosed warden but I can’t remember his name. He’d been in Banff forever. He was really western and broke horses until he was well into his sixties. He had done the early years of training with Walter Perren, one of those guys that never wanted to change his ways, he wanted to be a district warden forever. Centralization really affected him. So, he used to say to Tim Auger, “Don’t be surprised if I come free climbing past you”. So Tim would tell us the story when we were out climbing, just the way he would reiterate it, about his guy who was a total western dude who didn’t ever want to climb on a rock after he’d taken the training with Walter Perren, etc. He was very anti that whole mountaineering part and he had all of these famous sayings that he (Tim) used to banter around the Warden Office after he left but that’s the only one that I remember.
He ended up with some sort of injury so retired early with some sort of a disability. And it was Eric Dafoe’s brother who was his insurance adjuster in Calgary for these insurance claims of a personal nature. So Eric and I were in Calgary once doing something and we stayed with his brother. His brother asked “Do you know this guy who was this Warden who retired because of a disability, who then took up breaking horses when he was well into his mid sixties, and he was not afraid to admit it. And they wanted to cancel his disability insurance because he was breaking horses. Larry Gilmar would remember his name. I think he was originally from England. He came to Canada when he was really young, and grew up western, and got hired because of his backcountry and horse skills. He was quite the character. I actually met him once and he was very, very funny. So that’s my one legend….
(This person Tim refers to is Jim Rimmer. J.R. Rimmer served the warden service from 1961 to 1978).
SH: There’s got to be others. What about a Cliffy White story? (Tape 31:32)
Tim: Well, I’ll tell you. It goes back to that first prescribed burn. So the day before we were going to do the burn, or two days before, the indicies are climbing and we’re out there doing some test fires. So, when we start burning, we go, “Oh that’s pretty good, that’s not too bad”. So we are out there with the drip torches on the edge of the lake, and then “Let’s just do a little bit more, and a little bit more” and suddenly we’ve put up a huge column. So, we know the slope is ready but of course we never thought to tell Alberta Forest Service that we were doing some pre-ignition that day. So all of a sudden we’re on the radio, and the reception out at the far end there wasn’t very good. We finally call Dispatch in Banff of course, to tell Alberta Forest Service that they don’t need to come over and put anything out. We were actually out there doing our planned ignition the day before. It really did take off big and Cliffy’s eyes were kind of like, “Whoa”. And I was just learning so I was really like “Whoa” and Mark Heathcott who was usually going “Okay guys let’s put a little more flame, was saying “Hey guys I think we should stop”. It did get quite big the day before the burn. It would have been two days before the burn actually, when the big column went up. So that’s my Cliffy White story.
SH: It sure lowered the cost per hectare when you could do that with so few guys.
Tim: I think the total hectare was supposed to be about 2000 hectares but it actually ended up being quite a bit more, partly because of the activities that preceded the actual ignition date. Cliffy White he was quite the guy ….
Still is I’m sure. (Tape 33:23)
SH: Is there anything about the Warden Service, as you knew it, that you would want future generations to know?
Tim: If somehow, that really good culture that we’ve been laughing about and finding humor in …. teamwork, if that can be retained somehow through future years of less and less resources and delivering really good programs to the public. If that could be retained somehow, who knows how. I don’t know if it could be done these days, that’s all. It’s changed so much that’s likely gone.
SH: Leah gives me some hope with some of the new stuff, some of it’s there for sure.
Tim: Yes, keep working and keep believing I guess, it was such a positive place to work for so long that you really believed in what they were doing and that’s probably the biggest lesson.
SH: We were very fortunate for sure. What made the Warden Service such a unique organization?
Tim: I think again, because it was such an interesting group to work with, it was a really good cooperative culture within parks, between parks, working together and it made for a great place to do team work I’d say. That’s what I remember. In all the parks, lots of humor lots of laughs. So it was good.
SH: Do you have any lasting memories as a Warden? Favorite park, cabin, horse, trail, humourous stories, etc.
Tim: So working in Banff in the northern, because it was in sections, but in the northern part of the park, but I worked in Lake Louise and we had …. I can’t remember the name of the very north end, when I worked in Lake Louise so it was up there in the backcountry that (Indianhead?) Then when I worked in Banff we had the Cascade District and I rotated through there a few times. We did go do patrols through there a few times. Those were definitely good years, a lot of fun.
And the other part was going deep snow skiing in Glacier with Willi Pfisterer. He had so many good stories going back in all of his mountaineering career. Growing up in the mountains and he had the personal stories, working within Parks Canada. He had so many stories about wardens that could ski and couldn’t ski and big wrecks. He was hilarious to ski with, he was a top-notch skier, well into his later years. He was a lot of fun and once you got by his gruff exterior, his heart was in the right place for sure. He would criticize you and knock you down if you were not doing a good job, but he was very well meaning in the end.
SH: I remember that when I worked up there. Every year you’d get the Deep Snow School and Gord Peyto would try to make people fall, because he was another amazing skier.
Tim: So true. While we are talking about that, it reminds me of something that was pretty funny. You’d go on those Deep Snow Schools, and they had this snow cat, which was an old Tucker snow cat, gas powered, it wasn’t diesel. And they would always have more people show up on those schools than were supposed to because they were so popular. So they would be dragging about 3 or 4 people behind the snow cat on these long ropes. There was only room for three in the backseat and they’d stack another 2 to 4 people on this big box in the back. But one of Gord Peyto’s things was not only to get people to fall and freak out on the way down, but he had these little short cuts on the up track. They were really, really steep so there’d be a couple of people on the top who would invariably fall off when he was going up the short cuts. And then he’d have to stop, back up, they’d get on and he’d go back on the regular up track. It was actually really funny unless you were the person falling off and got chucked into the snow. And all the guys that were on the back on the ropes would have to shuffle backwards and shuffle backwards while he backed up. He’d be laughing like hell and then off we’d go again. I’d forgotten all about that.
Have you interviewed Gord?
SH: Yes. I did a lot of quarry work with Gord when he was a dogmaster. He and I got into lots of mischief. He was so big on practical jokes.
Tim: Oh he was. He is so much of a better skier that the average warden. He would take off and he had these secret little runs so I figured out not too long after … just follow Gord and you’d have the best snow. So Willi would be leading the group and they would have agreed, secretly beforehand, who was going to go where so Gord would take off and ski these excellent little powder spots, and I’d just follow him and it was great. I did see him fall once, in all the years that I went skiing with him, he did actually do a complete face plant right in front of me when we were going down one of these little secret places that he had. He went in head first and came out of both skis but he came out laughing.
SH: Ya, not a lot of people ever saw him fall.
Tim: Yes and those were the years before digital cameras. I can still see him going in, going in, and I can still see him climbing out. It was pretty funny.
SH: One time he brought me in a birthday cake into the Warden Office at Glacier. He’d got an ammunition box and put shaving cream on top of it, and then put in a candle. I just went for the big taste of the icing that looked delicious. Oh he laughed. So I went to the kitchen that day for lunch and I brought him back, I always bring him back a dessert, so I brought a tart and I just sprayed tabasco sauce all over the cherry tart, and he just put it full into his mouth. Oh God that was funny. We liked to do a lot of practical jokes.
SH: Did you ever ski with Eric (Dafoe) on any of those Deep Snow Schools?
Tim: You know actually I didn’t. Before Eric went over to avalanche control we skied together as just part of working there but I don’t remember being … I’m sure he went on those, but don’t remember working with him. When we were working there we’d go on different days, sometimes we’d do the full five days, but I don’t remember being on those with Eric.
I do remember one, I don’t think it was with Eric. So this is a short one …. because there was the second snow cat there, when things were relatively quiet, the Glacier wardens would get together and we would do some deep snow skill training. There was a Superintendent I’m sure you’ve heard of, and his name was Roger Beardmore. He was parachuted in from Lands or Environment or something from Halifax and so he shows up green, green, green, and he realizes that hey the Superintendent can actually go out and do some things. So he got touring gear and then before I arrived there he had convinced Eric to take him out a few times. Then Fred Schleiss took him out skiing a few times up on Fidelity. So one of the times that we were going up, he’d hear about these things and he would come along. So he wasn’t with Eric that day. We kind of set him up so we’d ski fast because we were better skiers than him on average, and then we were skiing down. I can’t remember the name of the run but it’s the short one that comes out just below the station but you could get some really good turns in. You’d come out on the edge of one of those switchbacks and be about halfway down the Fidelity Road. So we’re skiing through the trees and we’re just …. It’s still fairly open but we know there’s a drop off coming. So we ski ahead of Roger and we don’t tell him there’s a drop off coming right where the snow cat would wait for us. He comes barreling out of the trees, full speed and there’s a drop off of maybe five meters. He goes straight off through the air onto the edge of where the snow cat parked, he landed on the hard stuff. He did a full garage sale, everything gone …. gloves, goggles, and landed splat face first in the snow, and we just stood there laughing. So we set him up for a huge fall and he took it. Because he liked to ski aggressively, he was always on your tail, so we thought if you’re going to do that you’re going to pay, so we didn’t tell him it was a drop off, and out he came….. bang. But he didn’t hate us for it, that was pretty funny.
SH: His son is one of the Visitor Safety guys, a mountain guide working out of Banff …. Aaron.
Tim: I met him a couple of times when he was in high school and he did a few beginner schools and I think we had a couple of the term staff go with him on those. I met him on one of those at the ski hill in Golden. I don’t think he’s like his dad. He’s a little more relaxed. Anyway, that was pretty funny. I can still see Roger flying through the air.
SH: Do you ever miss being a Warden?
Tim: Well you know you miss those funny times and the more serious times too, when you really helped somebody out. But no, they were good years to be employed and they were lots of fun. I just hope the new generation gets to have the same level of enjoyment and interest.
SH: I don’t think they get to be out in the field as much but I think they still get some fun.
Tim: Ya I think in order to do anything you almost need a full mountain guide with you.
SH: Do you have any photos of yourself as a Warden that you would like to donate to the Project, or that we may copy? Do you have any artifacts/memorabilia that you would like to donate to the Project (Whyte Museum).
Tim: Okay
SH: What year did you retire? What do you enjoy doing in retirement?
Tim: 2012. They kicked most of us out the door – hurray!
SH: There was big turnover in 2012 in Rev/Glacier wasn’t there?
Tim: Ya there was.
SH: So what do you enjoy doing in retirement as well as salmon fishing?
Tim: That has definitely been one of the highlights. But you are bobbing around out there in an 8 meter boat and those waves are big. But still kind of the same things. Do a lot of hiking, but not as much hiking in Rupert but that’s going to change in the future because there’s other places to move to. Going biking and mountain biking for sure. I run slow marathons. I usually do a marathon a year. Not very fast. I think I did California last year but fell apart in the last twelve kilometers. And then I run trails. So pretty active. So the usual things … reading, a bit of traveling. I’ve been to Hawaii this year before the Covid came. Did a lot of hiking there. So, traveling but mainly good outdoor oriented activities.
SH: So you’re thinking of moving from Rupert? Maybe you should move down this way.
Tim: I’m thinking that’s going to be in the cards in the next two years.
SH: Is there anything I haven’t asked you that you think I should know about the Warden Service?
Tim: We’ve pretty much got it covered.
SH: Is there anyone else I should talk to?
Tim: Ian Syme, Alan Westhaver (mentioned earlier in interview). End of tape (48:20)
Interviewer: Susan Hairsine
Susan Hairsine worked for over 30 years for Parks Canada in Resource Conservation and Operations in Mt. Revelstoke/Glacier, Jasper and Banff national parks. She also worked for Public Safety in Western and Northern Region. She was also the Executive Assistant to the Chief Park Wardens of Jasper and Banff national parks. During her career she obtained funding for an oral history of Parks Canada’s avalanche personnel. Her experience working with several of the interviewees during her and their careers has been an asset to the oral history project.
